May 28, 2016

#cpc16: MP Brad Trost called “bigot” at debate about Conservative Party’s definition of marriage

Faith GoldyRebel Host
 

Emotions were running high during a breakout session about the definition of marriage at the Conservative Party convention.

MP Brad Trost tells me what happened behind closed doors.

Comments
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commented 2016-07-06 20:02:48 -0400
Wrong story for the bottom post.
commented 2016-07-06 20:00:35 -0400
“The US isn’t in the “crapper” and neither is Ontario or Canada in general.”

Yeah, having a debt that exceeds your annual GDP by 15% and a continual deficit is great for the economy. USA! USA! USA!

Ontario. No Andrew, Electricity prices are not too high and the Ontario Liberals have not significantly increased he debt burden. And big deal about Canada going into unnecessary deficit spending. We have the oilsan… I mean sunny ways!
commented 2016-05-30 22:33:13 -0400
“Nnaumbua,

If they are truly consenting adults, then no.

The problem is that true consent will have to be proven as I am sure there will be instances where true consent is not really there. That the father is abusing the daughter and has control over her.

There are many factors at play here that will make it impossible for it to be made legal. Factors that don’t exist when it comes to gay people.

Such as a father and daughter having a child together and the health concerns attached to that."

Make up your mind. You’re saying that incestuous relationships between consenting adults should not be illegal AND that they should be illegal.
commented 2016-05-30 22:22:36 -0400
“Nnaumbua,

Yes really.

Pedophiles CAN be contributing members of society if they get the help that they need. That is what we are talking about here. Pyromaniacs can also be contributing members of society is they get the help they need.

As I said – what they are trying to do is reduce the demonization of pedophiles, so that more come out of the woodwork and get the help that they need, so they don’t harm children – which would be illegal by any standard.

What’s so hard for you to understand here? "

Should pedophilia be stigmatized? Yes or no?
commented 2016-05-30 17:42:10 -0400
And again why are we even talking about this nonsense? It is every bit as bad as the liberals hectoring us about islamaphobia. In this country it is legal for same sex couples to marry whether we support it or not.
commented 2016-05-30 15:42:20 -0400
If you want to lead a risky life style, that’s not my problem. My problem is with trying to forcer others to believe that your risky life style should have more rights than my non-risky life style.
commented 2016-05-30 14:02:12 -0400
Jack,

I never said that. I would be fine with killing those who rape a 5 year old child.

Is your life that pathetic and empty that you give a shit about the LGBT?
commented 2016-05-30 13:50:28 -0400
MM wants us to stop condemning the rape of 5 years old? Sick puppy.
commented 2016-05-30 13:49:23 -0400
Because it doesn’t end with gay marriage. The GAYstapo will never stop until we all declare our love and worship of the gay and LGBT lifestyle. We will have to accommodate them in washrooms, in performing marriages for them, in baking cakes for them, ect…
commented 2016-05-30 13:42:12 -0400
If you know that putting a knife into an electrical outlet has one shocking consequences, something you learn as a child, you don’t repeat it even if you like putting knives in electrical outlets.
Same deal. If you like molesting children but the consequences are extremely harsh punishments, you will not prey on children unless you are completely fruit loops. You learn to curb your appetites.
I’m sorry but I have no patience for apologists that try to “talk” everything to death. There is a time when the talk must cease and action be taken.
Social engineers love to talk, but then they are paid by the hour.

DJBT and STPC
commented 2016-05-30 13:17:05 -0400
Nnaumbua,

Yes really.

Pedophiles CAN be contributing members of society if they get the help that they need. That is what we are talking about here. Pyromaniacs can also be contributing members of society is they get the help they need.

As I said – what they are trying to do is reduce the demonization of pedophiles, so that more come out of the woodwork and get the help that they need, so they don’t harm children – which would be illegal by any standard.

What’s so hard for you to understand here?
commented 2016-05-30 13:11:23 -0400
Nnaumbua,

If they are truly consenting adults, then no.

The problem is that true consent will have to be proven as I am sure there will be instances where true consent is not really there. That the father is abusing the daughter and has control over her.

There are many factors at play here that will make it impossible for it to be made legal. Factors that don’t exist when it comes to gay people.

Such as a father and daughter having a child together and the health concerns attached to that.
commented 2016-05-30 07:26:48 -0400
Well said Sheldon.
We have way too much government in our lives.

DJBT and STPC
commented 2016-05-30 07:24:36 -0400
I’m afraid I can’t buy the idea that being a pedophile is OK.
I can understand the idea that adults can love children but to sexually abuse them is not something that anyone should either accept or condone.
A pedophile who commits child abuse is truly a sick individual and in serious need of help. However, if pedophiles were subject to extremely severe punishment (and here I don’t mean simply a fine, psychiatric care and house arrest) but serious jail time with a minimum of five years to life without chance of parole, I am pretty sure they would be able to control their urges.
Today’s society is too politically correct and ready to accept any form of deviant behaviour as acceptable. Think about the refugees in Europe claiming sexual emergencies as a reason to grope and rape young people. Is this normal or deviant behaviour?
Children exposed to any form of sexual abuse from pedophlies carry scars of guilt and shame with them to their graves. Psychiatric care cannot cure these damaged individuals, it can only mitigate some of the symptoms.
But in reading some of the posts on this site, it seems everyone is more concerned about the rights of the pedophiles but aren’t too worried about the kids.
If the consequences to one’s actions are sufficiently severe and that one can understand what the consequences are, one will act in a way so as not to face the consequences. On the other hand, if one truly does not understand the consequences of one’s actions, then one is truly mentally challenged and is deserving of some form of help.

DJBT and STPC
commented 2016-05-30 02:10:04 -0400
Why is the government so obsessed with human relationships? I had to complete the governments inquisition this weekend and complete the census. Why is the government asking questions about sexuality?? What is their end game? If they would be consistent then they have no business asking these questions. The fact is that governments are made up of people. People have beliefs and agendas to advance. What drives me crazy is that the average citizen can’t see that or give a damn!
Marriage should have nothing to do with the government! The government has no more right to issue marriage licenses than they do friendship licenses or ‘I don’t want to spend time talking to you’ licenses or saying this is what a relationship is or is not!!! Government get out of my life! Marriage is a religious institution. It always has been and always will be. You can high jack the word but that is all government or advocates for non-traditional marriage do. Civil unions, common law, and other definitions are just another way for the government to invade people’s relationships. What for? To take our money and use human relationships as a means to political ends.
I am glad I did not get married in this country. My marriage has nothing to do with government and in my humble opinion it is something everyone should force government to leave alone. Do you need a license to abort an unwanted child? Is there a tax on this practice? What about assisted suicide? Those people who advocate for legalization of these highly controversial, suspect, and damaging moral and social issues are now inviting government to legislate morality on human relationships. This is syspicicously inconsistent. Morality politics are being foisted on us and we have no where to run and hide! Yet our government is a reflection of our misguided culture. The citizens are okay with this. I just don’t get it?! Well, actually I do get it but getting our ‘progressive’ culture to wake up seems impossible.
commented 2016-05-30 00:59:04 -0400
"
Nnaumbua,

I don’t care to be honest – even though your incest relationship with your adult daughter will never be legal. It has zero impact on my life – just like gay marriage has zero impact on your life."

Come now Michael don’t hide behind the illegality of incest. I want to know if it SHOULD be illegal. Homosexuality used to be illegal and now it is not. If two consenting adults want to enter into an incest involving relationship, should the government prohibit it?
commented 2016-05-30 00:55:15 -0400
“Nnaumbua,

My point is that NO ONE is trying to make pedophiles an accepted part of society and thus soon to be legal. What they are trying to do is reduce the demonization of pedophiles, so that more come out of the woodwork and get the help that they need, so they don’t harm children – which would be illegal by any standard. "

Really?

“We believe that persons who are sexually attracted to children can be contributing members of their communities and that they deserve to be treated with respect. All clients should be treated in a caring, non-judgmental, and respectful manner”

http://www.b4uact.org/about-us/principles-and-perspectives-of-practice/
commented 2016-05-30 00:50:42 -0400
Stephen Hutmacher – Thanks for the video. Interesting about how existing marriages have therefore been redefined due to the inclusion of same sex unions. What an insult to couples married for years.
One has to consider gay politics seeking power and ownership over traditional marriage and the power struggle with the Catholic Church. By ‘acquiring’ marriage rites/rights, it can/could be perceived as having won over the Church.
One man stood up at the CPC expressing why he, as a gay Conservative man, was not getting what he wanted from this party.
Its kinda like going into a Chinese restaurant and demanding they serve Italian food, change their menu and staff, because you are Italian.
Then don’t go to a Chinese restaurant.
commented 2016-05-30 00:28:32 -0400
Nnaumbua,

My point is that NO ONE is trying to make pedophiles an accepted part of society and thus soon to be legal. What they are trying to do is reduce the demonization of pedophiles, so that more come out of the woodwork and get the help that they need, so they don’t harm children – which would be illegal by any standard.
commented 2016-05-30 00:24:20 -0400
Nnaumbua,

I don’t care to be honest – even though your incest relationship with your adult daughter will never be legal. It has zero impact on my life – just like gay marriage has zero impact on your life.
commented 2016-05-30 00:23:36 -0400
Michael Mann said:

“Nnaumbua,

There is an advocacy group for EVERYTHING in this world.

Fred Berlin, director of the Sexual Behavior Consultation Unit at Johns Hopkins says that many pedophile activists are concerned that the term “has become a stigmatizing pejorative,” a way of saying “that somebody is less than human.” They’re unlikely to get much sympathy from the general public for being stigmatized, but Berlin says it’s in society’s best interest to resist demonizing them. “The idea is to try to get folks who are sexually attracted to children to come forward and get help before acting so that children are not harmed,” he said. “That’s certainly a goal that I would fully support.”

He adds: “None of us as little children sit down and ask ourselves the question, ‘Do I want to grow up to be attracted to men or to women, to boys or to girls?’ Nobody sits down, reflects about that and then decides,” he argues. “If someone realizes while growing up that they’re attracted to pre-pubescent children, it seems to me it is very important for them to know that there are places they can go to get
help before they act on those feelings.”

So what’s your point?
commented 2016-05-30 00:01:06 -0400
“Nnaumbua,

I don’t care what you want to do behind closed doors or even out in the open with your consenting adult daughter that you are fucking – government/the law may have a different view though."

But should the government have a different view?
commented 2016-05-29 23:57:43 -0400
Nnaumbua,

I don’t care what you want to do behind closed doors or even out in the open with your consenting adult daughter that you are fucking – government/the law may have a different view though.
commented 2016-05-29 23:54:03 -0400
Nnaumbua,

There is an advocacy group for EVERYTHING in this world.

Fred Berlin, director of the Sexual Behavior Consultation Unit at Johns Hopkins says that many pedophile activists are concerned that the term “has become a stigmatizing pejorative,” a way of saying “that somebody is less than human.” They’re unlikely to get much sympathy from the general public for being stigmatized, but Berlin says it’s in society’s best interest to resist demonizing them. “The idea is to try to get folks who are sexually attracted to children to come forward and get help before acting so that children are not harmed,” he said. “That’s certainly a goal that I would fully support.”

He adds: “None of us as little children sit down and ask ourselves the question, ‘Do I want to grow up to be attracted to men or to women, to boys or to girls?’ Nobody sits down, reflects about that and then decides,” he argues. “If someone realizes while growing up that they’re attracted to pre-pubescent children, it seems to me it is very important for them to know that there are places they can go to get help before they act on those feelings.”
commented 2016-05-29 23:45:23 -0400
“Implications of allowing gay marriage.

LOL.

Conservatives sure do love the hyperbole and fear mongering. "

What you have a problem with a relationship between two consenting adults?
commented 2016-05-29 23:41:05 -0400
Andrew’s answer to Nnaumbua is enlightening, especially in light of (was it Andrew or Michael Mann, I don’t quite remember) saying that the ‘slippery slope’ that socons fear is just a socon myth without any reality to it?

Kind of puts the lie to that assertion, doesn’t it? Hey Andrew, how about pedophilia? Any problem with that?
commented 2016-05-29 23:40:38 -0400
Implications of allowing gay marriage.

LOL.

Conservatives sure do love the hyperbole and fear mongering.
commented 2016-05-29 23:36:08 -0400
Oh, and the same arguments used to normalize homosexuality are being used to normalize pedophilia. Just another pesky implication:

“If I seek mental health services, does that mean I’m saying that my attraction to minors is a sickness?

No. We are trying to make services available to minor-attracted people who want them to work through issues unrelated to their sexuality, to deal with society’s response to their sexual feelings, or to develop satisfying and productive lives while living within the law. We are not advocating treatment to change sexual feelings."

http://www.b4uact.org/attracted-to-minors/faq-for-maps/

“*We understand that the attraction to children or adolescents is both sexual and emotional, and that individuals do not choose to have these feelings.* People who are attracted to minors usually recognize their feelings in adolescence or young adulthood, and feel that they are very different from other persons.”

http://www.b4uact.org/about-us/principles-and-perspectives-of-practice/

“*6. Stigma reduction.* We recognize the severe stigma directed against minor-attracted people by the media, politicians, law enforcement officials, and some mental health professionals. We oppose the perpetuation of false stereotypes and the use of language that instills fear in the public, fails to promote understanding, and ignores the humanity of minor-attracted people.

http://www.b4uact.org/about-us/principles-and-perspectives-of-practice/

…because it’s 2016, or something.
commented 2016-05-29 23:29:11 -0400
At least Andrew is going into this with his wide eyes open. Some people don’t want to acknowledge these implications of allowing gay marriage. They just accuse socons of scaremongering but there is nothing logically inconsistent with allowing the scenario I outlined below and gay marriage if you hold the premise that consent is the only relevant criteria to determine the morality of a relationship.
commented 2016-05-29 23:17:41 -0400
“Consensual relationships of any nature should be permitted. As long as everyone involved is OK with it, it’s none of my business.”

Hey, at least your consistent. So if your son turns 45 and wants to marry his consenting 25 year old daughter it’s nice to know you’ll give him your blessing. And when he turns 70 and he wants to marry his consenting 25 year old granddaughter (who is also his second daughter)… well God bless him!