June 10, 2015

Do most Canadians favour a mandatory expansion of CPP?

Marissa SemkiwRebel Commentator

According to a Forum Research poll, a majority of Canadians support the idea of increased contributions to the Canada Pension Plan but is this the result of misleading poll questions?

The NDP and Liberals have both called for a mandatory expansion of CPP, meaning higher payroll taxes.

The Canadian Federation of Independent Business calls this an "attack" on small business.

In contrast, the Conservatives recognize that CPP is meant to be one pillar of an individual's retirement, not to fund it completely.

Consider that this substantial increase to payroll taxes will result in only a marginal increase in payout. If you want a secure retirement, don't bank on the CPP.


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commented 2015-06-13 13:19:42 -0400
I see it as a good thing. People are barely making enough money to live on these days – never mind saving that money. Add any debt on to that and the idea of saving money for retirement is crazy talk. Most Canadians will not be able to save for retirement.

So for millions of Canadians – the CPP is ALL they have come retirement. If that amount is able to be increased through larger deductions now that they could afford – I think many Canadians would want this, especially considering that we all worry about the future. The days are over for any kind of job security and continued income, so this is where government is a good thing. Better than being old and living on the street.
commented 2015-06-11 17:52:18 -0400
I had only been working for a few years when CPP became a payroll deduction. As I had never saved dime one the deduction became my pension plan as nothing else was there.
You see the people wandering around pushing shopping carts filled with their only possessions? Thanks to CPP I’m not one of them.
My only complaint is my pension is fixed so the cost of living is stagnant and grocery prices and rent cost are not.
How about a voucher system to help with rent and food increases? Seniors earned their breaks.
People that worked for a living have a pension plan. People that didn’t work for a living have welfare. Criminals and slackers will have to be dealt with in the coming years. The money for welfare should be added to Workmans compensation and UI till the get jobs, not for the rest of their lives.
Now I know I have pi$$ed some people off but them’s the breaks.
If they refuse to work like so many have then something can be done about that.
Those that want to work find it.
commented 2015-06-11 16:38:24 -0400
Got a lot of boyfriends you would like to sign up? Just asking.
commented 2015-06-11 13:14:12 -0400
Under the Liberal government of Jean Chretien, the federal government used a $30 B surplus in the Public Service Pension Plan to pay down its deficit. The Supreme Court of Canada ultimately ruled the federal government did NOT have to repay that. The money did not come from the CPP. Contributions to the CPP are managed by the Pension Investment Board which operates at arm’s length from government.
Allowing Canadians to voluntarily contribute more to the CPP is preferable to a mandatory increase in contributions. A mandatory increase produces a negative effect on the employer due to increased payroll tax.
commented 2015-06-11 11:44:06 -0400
Simple, Government can’t manage a business. They need more of your money. They spin their money grab as a good thing.
You Lose!
commented 2015-06-11 09:31:55 -0400
If the CPP is to be tinkered with then make it the voluntary contribution idea being floated by the Conservatives. I can save for much of my own retirement and that should be my responsibility. I don’t want the government having more control over my life then it already has and if we all become totally dependent on a monthly government handout then they get to determine how we can live in our retirement years.
commented 2015-06-11 09:15:46 -0400
Well said. As a self employed individual, I understand the importance of investment. the government will not fund my entire retirement. I hope that the meager CPP will be there when I retire but I am not counting on it. I will have back up plans that’s for sure. As for employer contributions to the CPP, I understand that all too well. Having an employee myself, an increase to the employer contributions would have a negative impact my business for sure.
commented 2015-06-10 23:55:58 -0400
Great content; I have came across the result of the survey in local newspaper for Korean-Canadians. My impression was that the majority of Canadians are, unfortunately, supporters of growth in the role of the Government. Your analysis of the survey gives me some hope.
commented 2015-06-10 21:43:58 -0400
I believe if you search the records of CPP you will find that the federal gov. took several billion dollars from the CPP a few years ago.
commented 2015-06-10 20:36:47 -0400
The CPP is a very bad way to save for retirement. If you die without a spouse your estate gets nothing. If you have a spouse they only get 60% of your pension. Invest the money by yourself and your estate gets everything when you die and if you leave a spouse behind they get 100% of your investment returns. The CPP is a government sanctioned gambling – You gamble that you will live long enough to collect a return on your contributions.
commented 2015-06-10 20:21:01 -0400
You are right Prince, it is bad for small business especially. The bad out weighs the good. People need to take some responsibility for themselves, because when daddy government does it we all pay at least twice.
commented 2015-06-10 20:04:59 -0400
Actually, folks, the situation is worse than described — the respondents to this “poll” are individuals, and therein lies the “worse” issue.

Yes, you contribute to CPP through deductions to your earnings. BUT so does your employer, and at a higher rate than you pay. This means that your employer will pay substantially more with a mandatory increase. With large corporations, this may not be an issue. With small businesses, such as employing ten people or less, this becomes rather large — more expenditure for no extra income.
I’m willing to bet that most business owners are not in favor of this proposal…

Myself, being self-employed, I’ve taken the route Bravo Zulu suggested: I don’t contribute. Therefore, when the time comes, I won’t collect. I can invest savings much better than the government can, but how do I persuade Junior and Mulcair of that?
commented 2015-06-10 19:29:18 -0400
The only people that should be allowed to collect cpp are those who have contributed. All others find another way.

That will knock out tens of thousands of those who have come to Canada to help divvy up the dole over the past few years.

Wait – I sound like a responsible tax payer – I had better shut up – tax me – I am Canadian!
commented 2015-06-10 19:17:11 -0400
I’m guessing that the likes of Bob Rae and Mac Harb are doing ok with their pensions…
commented 2015-06-10 18:59:12 -0400
Kevin Nestor. “Excuse my French.” No problem. Your French is bang on!
commented 2015-06-10 18:44:04 -0400
When are they going to start allowing single taxpayers to have a beneficiary? My understanding of CPP is, that if you are not married when you pass away, your money goes back into the pot. This doesn’t seem right to me.
commented 2015-06-10 18:07:25 -0400
Here’s an idea. Tax us less instead of raising our taxes. That way we can save our own money. The reason most people can not save for retirement is taxes are TOO FUCKING HIGH!!!!!!!
commented 2015-06-10 18:04:03 -0400
No, I am one Canadian that is not in favour a mandatory expansion of CPP!
The increase that would be allotted would be very insignificant and as Marissa stated, one would be better off making other investments!
One needs ro be wise in this propaganda as from experience in having lived under both Liberal and NDP Socialist – Stasi style Government niether one of these two partys’ ever met a Tax that they did not love! They love to couge the citizens’ pockets like Central Bankers!
commented 2015-06-10 17:29:42 -0400
Good thing I opted out of CPP
commented 2015-06-10 16:10:29 -0400
You could be right, Sam. Marissa would have done better to focus on introduction of bias in question #3.
commented 2015-06-10 16:02:39 -0400
Question #3 of Ian Stephen’s comments is political and not informational. What politician is not political? All are. So, is there a “ploy” which would favour a politician? Yes! Which politician would it favour? Opposition politicians, after all, 47% is larger than 31%. Who can use these percentages in their favour? The opposition. Why was question #3 asked at all? To smear the Conservatives and try and make the “poll” look academic rather than political. Therefore, classify the poll as something you would shovel out of the barn!
commented 2015-06-10 15:37:42 -0400
Every good Financial planner will tell you to get and maintain control of your retirement finances, while the Drama Teacher Justinë is telling you the exact opposite. CPP provides for no control by the the investors, and in JT’s case he wants to invest it in infrastructure with no expectation of fund growth. RSP and TFSA investments allow the individual to specify the investments themselves or to hire an individual or firm to do it for them. Even the Saskatchewan PEP program provides a certain amount of control, allowing the user to specify from a number of fund options.
the other thing that seems to be missed is the fact that union contracts are negotiated on the total cost for the employees, benifits such as medical plans, UI contributions and CPP all reduce the employees base salary rate. If employers CPP contributions are increased then the salary increases wi reflect that and offset the added expense. But obviously JT has never been involved in contract negotiations.
commented 2015-06-10 15:12:23 -0400
Marissa says the Forum poll has a “blatantly misleading line of questioning”. The questions Forum asked can be found below, along with the results. Note that in the video Marissa left out the first half of the first question.

1. The CPP is designed to replace approximately 25% of pre-retirement income. Do you agree or disagree CPP employer and employee contributions should be increased, so benefits can be increased? (Agree: 59%, Disagree: 25%, Don’t know: 16%)
2. The federal government has proposed a voluntary expansion of the CPP, Additional contributions made by employees would be voluntary and employers would not be required to match them. Do you approve or disapprove of this proposal? (Approve: 45%, Disapprove: 39%, Dion’t know: 16%)
3. As far as you know, is this proposal a genuine attempt to help Canadians save for retirement, is it an election ploy or is it something else? (Genuine: 31%, Ploy: 47%, Something else: 14%, Don’t know: 7%)
commented 2015-06-10 15:04:12 -0400
Everyone knows that one can always get the answer they desire by posing the questions in a (mis) leading manner. That is likely why, in recent years, polls have shown to be off the mark, utterly incorrect in some cases. The Dippers have no credibility, what with their misuse (abuse) of parliamentary funds. Trudope admitted in a G&M article a month or so ago, he favours raiding pension plans to fund a Lieberal Gov’t’s spending plans. Both these political entities therefore have a vested interest in making Canadians involuntarily paying more into the CPP. And it has nothing to do with looking out for pensioners!